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Old 11-17-2008, 06:14 PM   #1
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Default Breeding Endorsements

What's peoples opinion on "progency not eligible for registration" endorsements? On another forum (that I'm now banned from ) they had a heated discussion with some views that I found rather strange myself.

I think they're a good idea, I would rather buy a pup that is endorsed as I think it shows the breeder cares about the puppies they're producing and the future of the breed.

In my eyes a puppy remains the partial responsibility of the breeder for it's whole life, the opposing view elsewhere was that people didn't want the breeder retaining a right over their "possession", I found that rather hard to get my head round.

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Old 11-17-2008, 06:20 PM   #2
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Its the sort of thing that I would like, as I believe that a dog has to be great for some reason to be bred from as there are so many in rescues, I don't know about dogs but I know that there are some cats that the breeders put a contract on that states that the new owners won't get papers until the cats are spayed/neutered which is kind of the same thing as with both they can breed to another animal but not register the babies if its the same breed, or breed to create a cross.
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Old 11-18-2008, 04:26 AM   #3
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i always endorse mine, however is it worth it? There's a litter of rough pups advertised at the moment as DLRC registered ,on checking it out turns out the bitchs registration had been endorsed "not to be bred from" .!
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Old 11-18-2008, 05:38 AM   #4
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I think it's a waste of time. If someone buys a pup with the intention of breeding ethically, they'll look for a suitable puppy for the purpose.

If someone just wants a litter of pups, an endorsement won't stop them. It might just mean those pups end up with slightly less fussy owners - ones that aren't bothered about KC registration.

Unless breeders spay/neuter the pups before they sell them on, there's not much that can be done unfortunately
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Old 11-18-2008, 06:35 AM   #5
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It's a good idea in principle, but as others have said it can't unfortunately be enforced.
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Old 11-18-2008, 06:38 AM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ajshep1984 View Post
What's peoples opinion on "progency not eligible for registration" endorsements? ",

Do you mean not eligible for "breeding" (resulting in not being able to register the offsprings) or "export"
I have never heard of not eligible for registration as you would expect the pups to be KC registered by the breeder...as should the parents / g/parents..and so on.

Yes I think it is a good idea, many of my friends already do this... they will endorse the puppies papers .

It is also important to note, that even with the care taken to try and protect pups with endorsements.. it will not stop the owner who is determined to breed from that dog....

Quote:
Quote:
I think it's a waste of time
. If someone buys a pup with the intention of breeding ethically, they'll look for a suitable puppy for the purpose.
Anything a breeder can do to help control unnecessary breeding is never a waste of time..

And as more and more breeders are going down this route, even if you are looking for a potential show/breeding bitch, dog, endorsements should not put you off.

A good ethical breeder will "lift" endoresment in the future of said pup, if and when health tests are acceptable, the dog is of type and worthy of breeding.

We cant on the one hand criticize breeders for breeding to many dogs, and no thought into their offsprings wellfare, then when they do do something , it is considered a waste of time....

If it stops one dog from being bred from for the wrong reason, it cant be a waste of time!!!
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Old 11-18-2008, 06:49 AM   #7
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i have only bred 1 litter & out of that litter let 1 pup go but i had endorsements placed on his registration to not only protect him but also the breed. If the new owner had wanted to breed him providing all the relevant health checks required for the breed were passed i would have lifted the endorsement. As it happened they had him neutered which i am really pleased about.
i personally would rather buy a puppy with endorsements i think its the responsible thing to do.

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Old 11-18-2008, 09:14 PM   #8
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All of my puppies go out on a limited registration.... (that is the AKC no breeding registration) which means that if the puppy is bred the progeny will not be eligible for akc registration.

The limited registration as they call it here is great and is just one more tool.... just becuase it is not enforceable doesn't mean it is not a tool that should be used. But clearly it is no substitute for adequate screening of puppy people.

There is more and more evidence showing that early spaying and neutering is not good for hte dog and as such I wont do it... but along with careful screening I find that the limited registration is just another tool in my arsenal

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Old 11-19-2008, 11:20 AM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by boxerpups View Post
Do you mean not eligible for "breeding" (resulting in not being able to register the offsprings) or "export"
I have never heard of not eligible for registration as you would expect the pups to be KC registered by the breeder...as should the parents / g/parents..and so on.
There is no 'not eligible for breeding endorsement' as until there's an actual law that restricts breeding it couldn't be enforced. The 'progency not eligible for registration' means any pups produced from mating the dog can't be registered with the Kennel Club. It's supposed to put off BYB's from breeding from unsuitable dogs.

I agree it's not fool proof, but it's a step in the right direction in my opinion. If someone does want to register the pups with the Kennel Club they must satisfy the original breeder that the relevant health checks have been done and the dog is of a good standard, suitable for breeding.

When breeders sell pups they also hopefully vet prospective owners and don't sell to anyone that they think will breed willy nilly.

My Border Collie pup was bought with endorsements, I had no intention to breed but as he was quite possibly the best in the litter they have encouraged me to show him and get the tests done with a view to using him as a stud, if he proves to be suitable they will lift the endorsements.

I don't think endorsements are a 'waste of time', without legislation controlling breeding, I think, it's the best that can be offered.

Don't get me started on DLRC.

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Old 11-19-2008, 02:29 PM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ajshep1984 View Post
There is no 'not eligible for breeding endorsement' as until there's an actual law that restricts breeding it couldn't be enforced. The 'progency not eligible for registration' means any pups produced from mating the dog can't be registered with the Kennel Club. It's supposed to put off BYB's from breeding from unsuitable dogs.

II don't think endorsements are a 'waste of time', without legislation controlling breeding, I think, it's the best that can be offered.

Arhhhh I see my mistake in misreading your post , and my using the wrong term. I think we mean the same thing, the resulting pups (progeny) are not eligible for registration... I thought you meant the endoresed pups..not being eligible


It is also important for anyone who is considering to endorse their pups.. to make sure the prospective buyer understands fully (before signing) the wording of the endorsed papers...

To guarantee the endorsement stays in place , the breeder , should go through word for word the meaning of the contract... otherwise it has been known for a buyer to aproach the KC asking for the endorsements to be lifted on the grounds of not fully understanding what they have signed.

I have a friend who endorse all her pups, and up till now, has only ever had one come back to ask for it to be lifted....after all relevant health tests, where done and the bitch was doing well in the ring.

I also know someone who had the endorsements lifted by appealing to the KC , as she had the relevant tests done but the breeder refused to lift the endorsements.


Bottom line being.... you do what you can, but even then there is no guarantee you will stop people breeding from said pups... If they have a mind to , they will papers or not.
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