Keep fingers crossed! - DogForum.net

Monkey · 02-15-2013, 11:20 AM

So I amgoing to do some pro bono training work for a rescue with a dog that has attacked another trainer. He gets sometimes extremely agitated and will turn on the person who touches him. Classic redirect with low impulse control. However, they have used a trainer I have had a run in with, God awful dominance trainer of whom I do not really like cause of the methods used, he loves dogs but you all know what I mean..

Either way, if I can prove point with this case, he will NEVER be used again.. He said the dog is so bad he needs an e collar.. NOT on my watch... He did bite this trainer..

So he will be boarded with Chessie's vet who's in on this, and Ill be going there every day after work and work with him for a couple of hours. We have a home lined up, that is his now foster home,but he needs to be calmer before the husband will let his wife (who's very small) keep him. So I will train him, with her as well..

I am so excited over this chance of spreading positive reinforcement, BAT etc.. OMG OMG OMG!

DeeLind7 · 02-15-2013, 11:58 AM

Moo, we know you can turn this dog around!! What type of dog is he? Please keep us updated. This should prove to be an interesting case for you. What was the dog's backround?

techie · 02-15-2013, 01:32 PM

Fingers and paws crossed! I remember Scooby and your other successes! It isn't always the dogs fault!
techie

Bigboy · 02-15-2013, 02:03 PM

Wonderful news Moo

I too believe through positive training methods you will turn this dog around! I have no doubts about this! What a excellent challange for you as you know the changes won't happen over night! I loved your comment No E-collars NOT on my watch Sadly some trainers are stuck in thier ways and don't develo new methods ! Yay go Moo I look forward to hearing the updates!

Sugar sb · 02-15-2013, 02:42 PM

That's great i know you can do it

PMR · 02-15-2013, 05:10 PM

Fingers and paws crossed for you both. Go Monkey

Monkey · 02-17-2013, 08:25 AM

Dee I am still laughing...
Ok... So.. I go to the house, expecting a very easily agitated 2 year old close to a 100 lbs pitbull right. I meet this sweet anxious very submissive boy who is sending out stress and apeasement signals a 100 miles a minute. So I totally ignore him, he jumps on me I calmly stand up, and after two of those he sits down in front of me. When he does I give him a treat (but I do not touch him). I sit and talk to the wife who tells me about the attacks that has happened, one which was pretty bad.. but they all had triggers and they all had moments where the dog was clear headed. Said and done, when I tell her what I want to do.. she gets anxiety... I wanna do what the other trainer did but with hot dogs instead of prong collar...

I still have mostlyignored the other dog, I barely look at him, I just feed him treats and keep saying yes, or carleton (which is his name poor dog no wonder he bites people).. Either way, we do mzzle him, he is very comfortable with the mzzle, he couldn't care less as long as I was feeding him hot dogs. I ct them long so I COULD fit them in the muzzle.

The woman have 9 pittie puppies in the house, he gets agitated by the squeeling, prey drive agitated, (thinking someone tried to train him to fight maybe or never thaught him impulse control around those sort of sounds and he has a high prey drive). Either way, there's a window between on the outside between mom and pups and him, and she has been the trigger to the attacks. When he barked once to say hi, she went ballistic and started charging the window, he had mild barrier frustration before this but this situation was what made it escalate. Both dogs are good with other dogs but I am thinking poor introdction made both dogs defensive inclding the puppies making momma dog more angry.

Either way, Julia had put up a big plastic bag so they couldnt see one another to help stop this from happening. On my que me being far away from the agitation she took it down and momma dog saw Carleton and started barking. Carleton paid no mind.. He was busy eating hot dogs doing sits for me..

I brought him closer and closer and closer until I was less than 3 feet away, he paid no mind at all, he was happy to get treats and praise... (I also had taken off the prong, I did this witha flat buckle). One time I didn't get treat out quick enough, he jmped on the window and did one bark, I said his name and he whips around sits down and begs for more treats.... I was outside that window for a good 15 20 seconds and then we walked away, he did two stress jumps on me, but that was it.. I brought him in, took mzzle off, he sat next to me asking for more treats.

The family came back out from puppy room and was FLOORED!!!! and I was like: I don't know how close the other trainer was but I think he did great. She said: it is like it is another dog, you were much closer than he was. Then she asks: what is the difference? and I explained to her dominance theory and how it really is bullying and how my methods teach them coping and how to behave and most dogs wants treats and praise and thus he feels calmer case nothing bad happened.

After this the dog wouldn't leave my side, he was glued to me even when treats was gone, he laid down and took a big sigh and laid his head on my feet. He was so smart he learned eye contact on one reward, he wants to work, he wants to please,he just never had anyone show him the way..

If I didn't have Scooby I would take him in a heartbeat... I expected a challenge, but he is the least hard dog I've so far ever dealt with who has bit someone, he don't wanna bite, he just wants to protect himself, when handled the right way, he wants to do nothing but to love you and obey. Never seen a dog being so happy over being switched to positive reinforcement, he behaved like he wanted to give me the world.

Im gonna bring the camera today, he is so pretty, he will need a very dog savvy home though with no kids. If he goes intoa frenzy he's pretty easy to break with a treat, but can't risk kids around that he may take out his prey drive on and knock over.. I feel that he can be a 100% changed but Ill do like I did with the othe dogs, place them in homes where they can't fail if something would revert and give the new owners the tools how to handle this..

Bigboy · 02-17-2013, 08:50 AM

This is good work moo hope fully the owners will see the difference and results which I must admt have been pretty quick to show up. This dog just needs leadership and direction and you are giving this

Well done and kepp up the good work

PMR · 02-17-2013, 10:22 AM

Great update, Moo. I'm so happy to hear it went so well.

techie · 02-17-2013, 10:55 AM

Fantastic update Moo! Just shows what love can do!

techie

02-15-2013, 11:20 AM	#1
Monkey Senior Member Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: North Massapequa Posts: 9,690 Blog Entries: 23 Rep: 130 Unique Rep: 64	Keep fingers crossed! So I amgoing to do some pro bono training work for a rescue with a dog that has attacked another trainer. He gets sometimes extremely agitated and will turn on the person who touches him. Classic redirect with low impulse control. However, they have used a trainer I have had a run in with, God awful dominance trainer of whom I do not really like cause of the methods used, he loves dogs but you all know what I mean.. Either way, if I can prove point with this case, he will NEVER be used again.. He said the dog is so bad he needs an e collar.. NOT on my watch... He did bite this trainer.. So he will be boarded with Chessie's vet who's in on this, and Ill be going there every day after work and work with him for a couple of hours. We have a home lined up, that is his now foster home,but he needs to be calmer before the husband will let his wife (who's very small) keep him. So I will train him, with her as well.. I am so excited over this chance of spreading positive reinforcement, BAT etc.. OMG OMG OMG! __________________ I love dogs cause they do not lie. "I'm chillin' with the forum! "I've been fleeced by Draco!" "I've been fleeced by JGLI"

02-15-2013, 01:32 PM	#3
techie Senior Member Join Date: Jan 2008 Location: In mid Willamette valley in Oregon Posts: 7,346 Blog Entries: 19 Rep: 31 Unique Rep: 13	Fingers and paws crossed! I remember Scooby and your other successes! It isn't always the dogs fault! techie __________________ I HAVE BEEN KISSED!! by sheplovr Dogs rule! "I've got the do: you?" A dog's love is pure! Lucy 1999 - Oct.6,2012. Always in my heart. Now owned by a female beagle, Rascal

02-15-2013, 02:03 PM	#4
Bigboy Senior Member Join Date: Mar 2008 Location: UK: Stoke on trent Posts: 10,440 Rep: 62 Unique Rep: 32	Wonderful news Moo I too believe through positive training methods you will turn this dog around! I have no doubts about this! What a excellent challange for you as you know the changes won't happen over night! I loved your comment No E-collars NOT on my watch Sadly some trainers are stuck in thier ways and don't develo new methods ! Yay go Moo I look forward to hearing the updates! __________________ " Iam chillin with the forum! " Thanks Monkey! I been fleeced Thanks Skunkstripe. Dave ATB!

02-17-2013, 08:25 AM	#7
Monkey Senior Member Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: North Massapequa Posts: 9,690 Blog Entries: 23 Rep: 130 Unique Rep: 64	Dee I am still laughing... Ok... So.. I go to the house, expecting a very easily agitated 2 year old close to a 100 lbs pitbull right. I meet this sweet anxious very submissive boy who is sending out stress and apeasement signals a 100 miles a minute. So I totally ignore him, he jumps on me I calmly stand up, and after two of those he sits down in front of me. When he does I give him a treat (but I do not touch him). I sit and talk to the wife who tells me about the attacks that has happened, one which was pretty bad.. but they all had triggers and they all had moments where the dog was clear headed. Said and done, when I tell her what I want to do.. she gets anxiety... I wanna do what the other trainer did but with hot dogs instead of prong collar... I still have mostlyignored the other dog, I barely look at him, I just feed him treats and keep saying yes, or carleton (which is his name poor dog no wonder he bites people).. Either way, we do mzzle him, he is very comfortable with the mzzle, he couldn't care less as long as I was feeding him hot dogs. I ct them long so I COULD fit them in the muzzle. The woman have 9 pittie puppies in the house, he gets agitated by the squeeling, prey drive agitated, (thinking someone tried to train him to fight maybe or never thaught him impulse control around those sort of sounds and he has a high prey drive). Either way, there's a window between on the outside between mom and pups and him, and she has been the trigger to the attacks. When he barked once to say hi, she went ballistic and started charging the window, he had mild barrier frustration before this but this situation was what made it escalate. Both dogs are good with other dogs but I am thinking poor introdction made both dogs defensive inclding the puppies making momma dog more angry. Either way, Julia had put up a big plastic bag so they couldnt see one another to help stop this from happening. On my que me being far away from the agitation she took it down and momma dog saw Carleton and started barking. Carleton paid no mind.. He was busy eating hot dogs doing sits for me.. I brought him closer and closer and closer until I was less than 3 feet away, he paid no mind at all, he was happy to get treats and praise... (I also had taken off the prong, I did this witha flat buckle). One time I didn't get treat out quick enough, he jmped on the window and did one bark, I said his name and he whips around sits down and begs for more treats.... I was outside that window for a good 15 20 seconds and then we walked away, he did two stress jumps on me, but that was it.. I brought him in, took mzzle off, he sat next to me asking for more treats. The family came back out from puppy room and was FLOORED!!!! and I was like: I don't know how close the other trainer was but I think he did great. She said: it is like it is another dog, you were much closer than he was. Then she asks: what is the difference? and I explained to her dominance theory and how it really is bullying and how my methods teach them coping and how to behave and most dogs wants treats and praise and thus he feels calmer case nothing bad happened. After this the dog wouldn't leave my side, he was glued to me even when treats was gone, he laid down and took a big sigh and laid his head on my feet. He was so smart he learned eye contact on one reward, he wants to work, he wants to please,he just never had anyone show him the way.. If I didn't have Scooby I would take him in a heartbeat... I expected a challenge, but he is the least hard dog I've so far ever dealt with who has bit someone, he don't wanna bite, he just wants to protect himself, when handled the right way, he wants to do nothing but to love you and obey. Never seen a dog being so happy over being switched to positive reinforcement, he behaved like he wanted to give me the world. Im gonna bring the camera today, he is so pretty, he will need a very dog savvy home though with no kids. If he goes intoa frenzy he's pretty easy to break with a treat, but can't risk kids around that he may take out his prey drive on and knock over.. I feel that he can be a 100% changed but Ill do like I did with the othe dogs, place them in homes where they can't fail if something would revert and give the new owners the tools how to handle this.. __________________ I love dogs cause they do not lie. "I'm chillin' with the forum! "I've been fleeced by Draco!" "I've been fleeced by JGLI"

02-17-2013, 08:50 AM	#8
Bigboy Senior Member Join Date: Mar 2008 Location: UK: Stoke on trent Posts: 10,440 Rep: 62 Unique Rep: 32	This is good work moo hope fully the owners will see the difference and results which I must admt have been pretty quick to show up. This dog just needs leadership and direction and you are giving this Well done and kepp up the good work __________________ " Iam chillin with the forum! " Thanks Monkey! I been fleeced Thanks Skunkstripe. Dave ATB!

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Keep fingers crossed!

02-15-2013, 11:58 AM	#2
DeeLind7 Senior Member Join Date: Apr 2011 Location: Delaware, USA Posts: 6,899 Rep: 54 Unique Rep: 27	Moo, we know you can turn this dog around!! What type of dog is he? Please keep us updated. This should prove to be an interesting case for you. What was the dog's backround?

02-15-2013, 02:42 PM	#5
Sugar sb Senior Member Join Date: Sep 2007 Location: Norhern Ca Posts: 680 Rep: 14 Unique Rep: 0	That's great i know you can do it

02-15-2013, 05:10 PM	#6
PMR Senior Member Join Date: May 2008 Posts: 608 Rep: 20 Unique Rep: 3	Fingers and paws crossed for you both. Go Monkey

02-17-2013, 10:22 AM	#9
PMR Senior Member Join Date: May 2008 Posts: 608 Rep: 20 Unique Rep: 3	Great update, Moo. I'm so happy to hear it went so well.

02-17-2013, 10:55 AM	#10
techie Senior Member Join Date: Jan 2008 Location: In mid Willamette valley in Oregon Posts: 7,346 Blog Entries: 19 Rep: 31 Unique Rep: 13	Fantastic update Moo! Just shows what love can do! techie __________________ I HAVE BEEN KISSED!! by sheplovr Dogs rule! "I've got the do: you?" A dog's love is pure! Lucy 1999 - Oct.6,2012. Always in my heart. Now owned by a female beagle, Rascal

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