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sadiepup 05-24-2010 08:23 PM

Split heat
My oh my

Sadie went into heat right around april 1st. I put her in a kennel and roughly 10 days later they called me and told me she is done! To my huge excitement because her last heat lasted about 25 days. I drove sadie home very happy to spend some quality time with her as I missed her so much.

I noticed a week later the swelling in her female parts did not go down like it had at the end of her last heat. I figured she was just being a teenager in puberty and refusing to give up on getting pregant.

3 weeks went by and the swelling had actually increased so I knew something was up. I thought for sure there was something terribly wrong. Then a little over four weeks from when I picked her up, she started bleeding like crazy again.

I thought at first she was ill or had bad diet, but I have been feeding her the usual food. I noticed a huge increase in urination and blood flow. I thought maybe she had somehow gotten pregnant in the kennel and was now having a miscarriage. Online I began researching miscarriages and came across a split heat. I believe sadie to be in a split heat.

She is a 50lbs blue nose pit bull. We kept her unspayed because that is what I was instructed to do by a veteran weight puller. He said keeping her unspayed until her second or third heat would insure her body developed to its full potential.

Has anybody dealt with a split heat before? My main concern is how long this second "true" heat will last for. Like if she already bled for 10 days does that mean this one be shorter or will it be a full month like a normal heat?

April 05-24-2010 09:45 PM

I have no knowledge of a split heat, but as this is her 2nd heat I would be getting her spayed a couple of months after she finishes. I was told to only have one heat as the risk of mamary cancer increases greatly from 8% after one heat to 23% - 26% with the 2nd & increasing with each successive heat.

Have you taken her to the vet?

white cat lover 05-24-2010 11:51 PM

I would also speak with your vet about this. If you don't intend to breed her, then usually the maximum anyone suggests letting them go into heat before spaying them is once. The more she is allowed to go into heat, the greater the risk for pyometria (uterine infection - can be deadly) & cancer.

sadiepup 05-24-2010 11:53 PM

my step mom is a vet/bulldog breeder and she is my main source of information. xshe says there is is nothing immediately threatening about a split heat. She is concerned however that spaying her during heat would kill her because she says sadie has the heaviest blood flow of any dog she has ever seen. What if I never get her spayed but dont breed her whats the risk of cancer then? My step mom said she also has never dealt with a split heat and she was not a great source of information. She basically said it happens to younger dogs and doesn't really mean anything.

sadiepup 05-25-2010 12:08 AM

okay so if spaying her now is going to put her at risk, what if i keep the option to breed her but never follow through? what if i keep her intact and dont decide to breed her untill i am financially able to support a pregnant bitch, and have a big house for the pups. Right now I live in an apartment, which I do not believe would be a responsible place to deliver a litter.

I also have had a mate in mind an intact gorgeous male purebred as well. The reason we decided not to mate was I read so much negativity online about breeding pits. I posted on another forum site my intentions and was scrutinized by every poster. I felt dumb and decided against it. But now in my current research I am seeing all of these pups in the pound are pit mixes. My girlfriend (sadie's mommy) seems to believe that some if not most are purebreds they just label them pit mix so people will be more likely to buy one. Anyway, if they are all truly mix breeds then that leads me to believe that there still is a market for purebreds and it might still be a good idea.

all in all i just want to do what is best for my dog (and best friend in the whole world). My original intentions were yes to mate her. Now I just want to make sure she will be ok, and do not feel either way about breeding her. It would be nice but if the puppies will all end up in the pound I obviously would not want to do it. If this is the case then it looks like spaying is out of the question with the increased risk. But will she be at risk if she keeps cycling and never gets pregnant? I know in wolf packs only the Alpha bitch will mate and none of the others will, so i think she will be just fine.

I would love some feed back.

k9capture16 05-25-2010 01:08 AM

Personally I would spay her. With all the poop going around with Pitbulls and the media why risk bringing puppies into this world that could end up in the wrong hands? Check with you city as some have laws regarding breeding these breeds. Now, onto spaying after her third heat. I would wait until shes done maturing which for a Pitter will be around 2. Spaying/Neutering before maturity can leave the dog predisposed to bones and joint issues as per the article below

Also if the female is spayed there is zero chance she will get pyrometra as they remove the uterus. Personally, the male I have now, I neutered him and kick myself in the head everyday about it. He was the first and the last I will ever fix. I will either own males or females (none at the same time), I prefer males anyway. This is only my take on it. Ask your vet about any negatives and I dont think they will tell you any. To me the only benefit neutering/spaying has for me is Birth Control. It eliminates Pyrometra in females and eliminates the less than 3% chance of your male getting testicular cancer. Here are a couple more links for you to read. I would still get her spayed around 2 years old. Dont breed her there are enough pure pitties and mixes in shelters as it is. I guarentee you if you ask any vet they will all tell you to spay or neuter, they claim health benefits and there are studies contridicting both, and money is involved..keep in mind vets are a business (not bashing vets but its true).

I may get chewed on for posting these links but since its my opinion ill post them for you to read. If you would like to hear about issues ive had with Lincoln after neutering PM me through the forum as I dont wanna carry this thread off topic...

applesmom 05-25-2010 02:28 AM

From the sound of your posts it appears that you've given the matter a lot of careful thought and have plenty of knowledgable folks to help you out with basic information. But there is still a whole lot more to learn!

It's estimated that half of the dogs put to death in shelters are pit or pit mixes; then there's the increased risk for breast cancer, pyometra etc, that has been mentioned in other posts. But there are other very important reasons to consider spaying her and allowing her be the great pet she is; rather than constantly struggling through erratic and potentially dangerous heats .

It's believed by; I think it's safe to say, by the majority of vets, that a bitch that experiences excessively prolonged heats may prove to be infertile. One reason being that the eggs may be too old by the time she is ready to mate. Also when there is excessive bleeding during the heat cycle the first thing vets suspect are ovarian cysts. Another possibility for the excessive bleeding could be von wildebrands (bleeding) disease. Something you most certainly wouldn't want to risk passing on to a litter of puppies. There is a simple test for VW which can easily be ruled out if you're determined to breed her.

As much as you care for her, I'm sure the last thing you'd want for her is to continue to put her at risk due to excessive bleeding or to suffer from multiple false pregnancies which tremendously increase the odds for pyometra and breast cancer. Or for her to suffer the the heart wrenching pain of previously undetected ovarian cysts. There are tests to rule out ovarian cysts and infertility, But since she is such a wonderful pet; why not just let her be a happy healthy dog without putting her and yourself through the heavy responsibilities of producing a litter of pups. Pups which due to the irresponsibility of some pet owners may wind up being put to death in shelters or carelessly used for breeding--or worse!.

Remember too; as great as potential puppy owners may seem at the time, you'd really have no control over their pup and it's welfare once they leave your care.

Good luck whatever you decide.

sadiepup 05-25-2010 04:01 AM

Thanks for all of the information. Was just on the phone with my step mom who said sadie was fully tested last weekend for everything when I brought her to Lisa's clinic. She said Sadie is very very fertile and there is no disease, infections, or cysts to worry about. She thinks breeding now and spaying at the end of pregnancy, or not breeding and spaying at the end of the heat, is the best for Sadie. (O and I forgot to ask her, and I'm pretty sure the answer is no, but will inducing pregnancy now stop or shorten the heat at all?). Lisa told me that the large quantity of discharge could be related to her extreme fertileness, who knows as long as my baby is healthy.

Another problem I ran into. It looks to me as if Sadie's mate is not a APBT, but rather is one of those American bullies. He is 65 pounds and has a 23" neck and about a two foot wide head, he is very stumpy (Kinda reminds me of Danny Devito). I am being told that American Bullies are inbred freaks and not real pit bulls. Granted they have been bf and gf since I adopted her, but if this is true about American Bullies being the hick inbreds of the dog world I know I don't want to reproduce them through my prize possession. The owner of patch (the stud) is telling me I don't know what I am talking about and that his dog is as purebred as Sadie (He even called me jealous). Patch's owner also has very high demands! He wants first pick male of the litter, say where half the litter ends up, he wants say on the price for his "half" of the litter, he demands Sadie eat Black Gold dog food, and also wants 50% of all profits.

My question. Even though he is my friend and I do not want to rip him off, if I do decide to breed with Patch, can he legally hold me responsible for all his demands? What if I breed dont sign any contract and be like here is your Dog its the runt thats all your getting that is breed standard... sorry bud. Could he take me to court?

sadiepup 05-25-2010 04:10 AM

2 Attachment(s)
Some pictures. Sadie is the Blue brindle, patch well has the big ol dog nuts and the patch on his eye. I think they would make gorgeous pups. That is the most current picture I have of patch he has filled out quite a bit since then and has that American Bully look about him.

skunkstripe 05-25-2010 08:24 AM

Hi sadiepup and welcome to the forum! :wave2:

Sadie is a lovely girl. Patch looks like he is built like a brick pagoda!

I can't help you with the one breed vs another aspects but as far as your friend insisting that you feed Sadie "Black Gold," he has say over who gets half of the pups etc it's a matter of whether or not there is a written contract. If you sign something and he can later prove you didn't abide by it, he will have a case for taking you to court. I can just imagine a judge's face when he/she has to preside over a lawsuit involving whether or not your fed Sadie according to the terms of a contract (and I can't imagine anyone actually suing over something like that) but if it is a question of monetary loss because your friend expected to be able to determine the fate of say four puppies with a value of $2000 each, it could get nasty.
I think ANYONE you get stud services from is likely to want some written agreement but you have to think about what terms you are prepared to accept.

Anyway good luck!

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